Talk:Elsa Schneider
From Indiana Jones Wiki
When she got killed do you think because Indy and Elsa "did it" could a kid of his been killed too98.213.199.148
[edit] Choosing wrong grail
- I don't think it's verified that she intentionally chose the wrong grail for Donovan. In fact, I've come upon a couple of people say that they thought she unintentionally chose the wrong one. On Movie Deaths, where it talks about Donovan's death, the person who wrote it believes that if she really did side with the Jones's, she wouldn't have waited until that moment to show her true allegiance. Also, in some review/ essay I read online someone wrote after watching the film, when he commented on that scene he said that Elsa's grail choosing was another cliche that was obviously gonna happen because Elsa was not only a villain, but she was also a woman, so of course she wouldn't have been as smart as Indy, the male hero. AFAIK I don't think it's confirmed what was the real reason she chose the wrong grail, but what I do know is the speculation of it possibly being for Henry getting shot does not conform to manual of style. Hanzo Hasashi 02:10, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
- Indiana Jones: The Ultimate Guide mentions on her page that she:
- 1. insists on picking out the Grail
- 2. "reveals the depths of her cunning when she selects the shiniest, most jewel-encrusted of the bunch"
- 3. "gives Indy a look that suggests she is doing it for Indy and Henry's sake."
- While #3 is more speculative as to her motives, it seems clear that she intentionally chooses the wrong grail for Donovan.
- Then on the page about the Grail Temple: "Realizing in his last moments of life that he has been tricked, Donovan turns on Elsa"
- Again, this indicates that she has chosen the wrong grail intentionally.
- I'd have to side with an officially licensed work over some "online essay" and someone at Movie Deaths. Jawajames 08:09, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
- Moreover, the very first think Elsa says after Donovan kicks the bucket is "It would not be made out of gold." She knows what to look fore before Indy says or does anything more. Unless it just suddenly occurs to her why the cup she picked for Donovan was wrong, she was playing him the whole time. Regardless, she figures it out by herself without Jones's help, so the alleged sexist cliche is bunk. You're right about the speculation not being consistent with the MOS, though. jSarek 09:13, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
- Alright then. Yeah, I don't have any of the encyclopedias, so thus I don't have all the sources to look into. So would that mean she DID wait until the last moment to show her true allegiance to Indy and his father? Hanzo Hasashi 17:38, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
- Moreover, the very first think Elsa says after Donovan kicks the bucket is "It would not be made out of gold." She knows what to look fore before Indy says or does anything more. Unless it just suddenly occurs to her why the cup she picked for Donovan was wrong, she was playing him the whole time. Regardless, she figures it out by herself without Jones's help, so the alleged sexist cliche is bunk. You're right about the speculation not being consistent with the MOS, though. jSarek 09:13, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
For what it's worth, the junior novel (2008) sez: Elsa continued to smile, but then she glanced at Indy and her smile melted away. Indy caught something in her gaze, a certain look that told him that maybe, just maybe, she had really learned something from her mistakes, and that she had just done something to try and make amends — or was it to further her own ends?
The 1989 version seems to imply she simply picks out what she thinks is the best looking cup and MacGregor's adult adaptation doesn't really suggest anything either way other than Indy being surprised she lets Donovan grabs it without protest. Vetinari (Appointment) 18:03, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
